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4" Plated Column

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4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Fri Feb 21, 2014 4:19 am

I contacted a guy that was selling stainless steel pipe for my thumper. Turned out he is a talented stainless welder and has been considering making a still himself recently. I had him make my secondary thumper and started putting him to work on my column. This column is going to be 3 plates and it 4" wide. The condenser is 3" wide and 12 inch long.

The plates are going to be copper and I'm planning on packing the 90 degree 4" with copper mesh. The ball valve pictured will be switched with a 3 way valve before all is finished.

Instead of using reducers, the guy building my column took a pipe cap, cut a 2" hole and then welded a ferrule to it. He did the same for the parrot connection. It's saving me some money and about 4 inches in high. I distill in my house, so it's nice to save some of that space.
bottom of column.png


Parrot Assembly. I think there is a little to many triclamps myself, but it'll be removable and I'll be able to use the parrot when running my pot still. So, can't really complain. What do ya'll think of the vent? Long enough?
Parrot Assembly.png


Here it is laid out.
Layout.png


He has ordered some sight glasses and will hopefully be finished this week. If all works out, I may have him build me another section so I can make some vodka from time to time. I"ll post the finish pictures when it's all said and done.

Cheers,

D Unicorn
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby JayD » Fri Feb 21, 2014 10:21 am

Looking good, keep us updated... :handgestures-thumbupright:
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Jaybird » Sat Feb 22, 2014 5:10 pm

Looks killer! Nice work man!

Cheers
Jay
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Tue Feb 25, 2014 3:26 am

So...apparently you don't need 23 inches for 3 plates. Not sure why I came out to that length. Had 8-ish inches cut out. We are using 2" cherry burrell fittings for the sight glass housings. Were considering 3 inche sight glasses, but there was some concern about warping the column. Not sure if it's really an issue, but the 2 inch will work so we went with that.

Pretty much all that's left is to figure out how I want the coolant to flow, get some gaskets and the glass.
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby JayD » Tue Feb 25, 2014 4:41 am

are you going to put a ferrules and a clamp in the 180* ? I always do, as it help you line it all up and you dont have to run the pc vertical, it just makes your rig a little more versatile.Looking good though.
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Tue Feb 25, 2014 6:26 am

The 180 is one piece. There are 6 ferrules on the column. This was largely build by a collaboration between what my welder had on hand and how I needed the column to work. Example, we ended up using a couple cherry burrel fittings, but we aren't sure what the gaskets are made out of. Will most likely buy new gaskets just to be safe.

He came by today and dropped off the column. The plated tree wasn't quite right, so he is going to redo that and see if he can't order some glass for me. Getting close!

Holy crap is it heavy. I swear it ways as much as my keg.

mount test.jpg
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Zombie » Fri Feb 28, 2014 6:24 pm

It is very pretty. Do you know what type of plates you are going to use?
Buy them or build them?

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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Sat Mar 01, 2014 1:45 am

Thanks.

The plates will be perforated...most likely. The guy making it isn't to savvy with copper, so it'll be all stainless.
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Zombie » Sat Mar 01, 2014 6:08 am

I have been reading ALOT on plate designs, and may be able to offer some help/ideas if you need. First big tip is look at Perf Stainless plate. Readily available in 1.6mm hole size, and IMHO it is much easier to fill the un wanted holes in the plate than it is to drill a thousand 1.6mm holes in Stainless. I am new to plated designs so I can tell you, there is alot of difference in plate types/layouts.

You are going to need some copper in the vapor path at some point as well. It removes some of the nasty sulfur compounds that leave bad taste/smell in the finished product. Copper scrubbies/screen/rat wire ect...

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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Sat Mar 01, 2014 8:13 am

He found some perforated stainless. The wholes are a little big, but his plan was to put to plates together and misalign them to make the holes smaller. He got sent on to a stainless welding assignment, so it'll be some time before he gets a chance to finish the plates. That good news is that I'll have time to research!

I thought there was only 1 or 2 designs. I'm planning to make high ester rum, so...that's my starting point.

-Unicorn
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Sat Mar 01, 2014 8:15 am

Oh and on the copper, I'm planning to pack that 4" 90 degree with copper mesh.
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Zombie » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:13 am

For what makes a good, better, best type product I have No clue. The guys here do so you are still moving forward.
Mis-aligning the Perf. plates is a bad idea (IMHO). The holes have to work sort of like Carburetor jets. Vapor has to pass efficiently thru the holes, and any diversion or re direction will affect the flow rate. What that can do is lower the vapor speed, and increase the pressure under the plate. The effect would be lowering efficiency at each plate. It will also create tiny vortexes in each hole, as well as a "shelf" of sorts that will hold liquid. That alone creates another set of problems.

Keep searching for the correct Perf. Plate. I found all sorts of appropriate hole sizing, and spacing available on line.
http://www.metalsdepot.com/products/sta ... ss%20Sheet Just one example. 1/16" hole size.
There are also shops that will custom cut the holes for you. A little pricey but you might save in the long run.
Google is my most used tool.

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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Zombie » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:21 am

http://www.chemengr.ucsb.edu/~ceweb/cou ... intern.pdf

http://www.ou.edu/class/che-design/desi ... Design.pdf

I'm reading the first one right now. VERY helpful in understanding how/why, and where the different types work best.

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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby JayD » Sat Mar 01, 2014 10:41 am

1.5 mm hole size to a 5mm grid patern works well with a 3/4 tube for a downcomer and a 1inch cap...I have used this for 3" 4" and a 6" plated column and it works very well. :handgestures-thumbupright:
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:03 pm

Jay,

I've found the 1.5 ml perforated plates, but I'm having a hard time understanding what a 5mm grid pattern is. I've been able to find perforated plates with 3.175 centers, is that the same or close enough?

Cheers,

Unicorn
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby JayD » Thu Mar 27, 2014 2:55 pm

a 5mm grid pattern is when you scribe from the center of the plate at 5mm intervals to the edge of the plate, then you turn the plate to 90* to mark and scribe from center of the plate to the edge of the plate once more...it will look like the sight of a gun, your drill location for your holes will be the intersection of your scribed lines... :handgestures-thumbupright:
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Fri Mar 28, 2014 3:34 am

Jay,

I'm actually looking at purchasing perforated stainless, not cutting. It sounds like the 3.175 is going to be to small. Is the 5mm the gap between the sides of the holes? Of is it center to center of the holes?

Maybe I can get the 3.175 centers and cover every other hole? Might create the correct surface area.
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Zombie » Mon Mar 31, 2014 8:13 am

Check out this site http://accurateperforating.com

They have 1.6mm hole size @ 8% open space. I have some, and have not tried it yet but with a vapor speed between 18-24 FPS it should work a charm. There is a Tech data page on their site that gives both air/liquid pressure drops for the plate so you can figure your max number of plates using your bath depth, and vapor speed.

The 1.5mm @ 7% open space is the accepted norm on these hobby scale rigs so I am interested to see how well this material works. The math says it does for my design of 6 plates @ 7500 watts.

They also have downloadable CAD, and PDF templates for reference.

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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby JayD » Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:04 pm

Drunken Unicorn wrote:Jay,

I'm actually looking at purchasing perforated stainless, not cutting. It sounds like the 3.175 is going to be to small. Is the 5mm the gap between the sides of the holes? Of is it center to center of the holes?

Maybe I can get the 3.175 centers and cover every other hole? Might create the correct surface area.


5mm center to center, center punch mark to center punch mark.
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Zombie » Mon Mar 31, 2014 12:28 pm

Center to center takes .75mm off every "hole" or 1.5mm off the distance between. leaving 3.5mm spacing. or .325 difference between your pre-made, and the accepted norm for home made.

I think we are really talking about the same material at 1% difference excluding "human error" in marking, and drilling. Not to go against the grain (so to speak). I have NO experience in this but the numbers almost cancel out.

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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby JayD » Mon Mar 31, 2014 1:07 pm

Remember the KISS principle...
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Mon Mar 31, 2014 3:21 pm

I'm all about keeping it simple, JayD.

The guy I'm working with is a real pain in the ass. I'm wishing I just ordered from you in the first place. :(

Thanks for the site Zombie, looks promising.

Unicorn
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby JayD » Thu Apr 03, 2014 11:47 am

JayD wrote:
Drunken Unicorn wrote:Jay,

I'm actually looking at purchasing perforated stainless, not cutting. It sounds like the 3.175 is going to be to small. Is the 5mm the gap between the sides of the holes? Of is it center to center of the holes?

Maybe I can get the 3.175 centers and cover every other hole? Might create the correct surface area.


5mm center to center, center punch mark to center punch mark.


Here's a photo of a plate we made sitting beside a 4" to 6" reducer waiting to be welded...

gridpatt.jpg
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby lookingforflavor » Thu Apr 03, 2014 1:13 pm

Ive said it before.

Many of you have great talent. Artists if you will.
Very nice work.

LFF
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Zombie » Thu Apr 03, 2014 1:25 pm

1-2-3... 66-67-68... 1,003-1,004-1,005. My head would be in the oven before finishing 3 plates. :lol:

I give you guys a TON of credit for all the effort involved in making these plates hundreds of times over. :clap:

4" x 6", and no downcomer??? :think: Is there a special purpose for this plate?

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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby JayD » Thu Apr 03, 2014 1:32 pm

Zombie wrote:1-2-3... 66-67-68... 1,003-1,004-1,005. My head would be in the oven before finishing 3 plates. :lol:

I give you guys a TON of credit for all the effort involved in making these plates hundreds of times over. :clap:

4" x 6", and no downcomer??? :think: Is there a special purpose for this plate?


thats because it is only a reducer so I can fit 6" stills onto a 4" still port on a boiler and visa versa, drilling these plates is a time consuming process but the end result is worth it...the drilled plate still needs two downcomer holes bored into it.
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Drunken Unicorn » Fri Apr 04, 2014 6:27 am

Very nice! Thanks for sharing!
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Re: 4" Plated Column

Postby Zombie » Fri Apr 04, 2014 12:31 pm

:handgestures-thumbupright:

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