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Sight towers

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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:16 am

Hi

Should you build a modular glass column 8-)

Cheers
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Thu Jan 17, 2013 7:50 am

So here I made ​​a 4 "modular glass column of Sd sight glass tower :idea:

If you look at Sd 4 "glass tower and also looking at the spare glasses and then harrys glass column .... video ..

the problem that I see might be if you have a whole long glass tube, the seal between the plate and the glass wall-colonnen. and as we all know, is expanding copper powerful when heated and can crack the glass if it is too tight ...

I intend to see if I can use 4 "glass tower and 5pc spare glass and 4" ferrules gaskets and larger copper plates with 1pc 4" silicon-EPDM ferrules gasket on each side of the glass so it will be close and possibly drilling into 4pc threaded rods to as the 8pc total ..and single solution is better for larger glass column is, because then it becomes even more stable sideways wearing it uses several short glass

This is a cheap glass column and fully modular and tightly between flat rates. :idea:

And would some glass breakage Well since this costs a tenth of a full length glass column,

Are we going to be really good, then cutit to 1.5 mm copper plate about 1cm too big, then so turning it into 2st round iron pieces that match the glass outer diameter exact +1 mm and settingen large the circular copper plate between them-centered and presses them together, then so slots be copper with 1cm intervals and beats every other piece (5mm) upwards and the other downwards, (5mm) then you have ensured that the glass will exact correct in every joint and seals also end up in the right place ......

Then you can decide if you want to make a Sieve plates or bubble plates of this combined plate and joint control of the glasses.
This a this I think could be a hit ...
I personally think that 4 "EPDM rubber gaskets are suitable for this ...best...
and remember that 6 "and 8" would be even more stable sideways if you are still using short pieces of glass ....

Cheers 8-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby DrWho » Thu Jan 17, 2013 10:31 am

minime wrote:I bought the two inch tower BTW. Just want to watch how reflux behaves as it enters the packing


It's well worth it, you'll like it. My first column (slant plate boka) got a sight glass to see the top of the packing and reflux shortly after the first couple of runs. It really let me see what was going on inside, and figure out why that set up wasn't working.

When I built the LM/VM column it got a sight glass right off. It is a great addition. Note that these are like the ones folks put on plated columns, but what you have will do the job. And no torch required to see in there.

I'd be tempted to fill it halfway with packing.

???
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Re: Sight towers

Postby Maheel » Thu Jan 17, 2013 1:44 pm

could you drill teflon for perferated plates ?

and then maybe "push fit" drill the downcomers .
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Re: Sight towers

Postby Stinger » Thu Jan 17, 2013 5:54 pm

AND wouldn't the left-over 4" sight-glass end pieces make excellent bolt-on keg/column connectors for the TIG-challenged? :idea:

Now, how can we use the guts of a 2" sight-glass so that the spare end pieces make excellent bolt-on keg/electric heat connectors for the TIG-challenged? :?:
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:30 pm

I would call this bubble glass ...
this would be a good one. cheap and cool solution in a modular 2 "LM, CM, etc column you can have a transition from 2" to 4 "too ....
As the seal so I personally think that EPDM rubber is suitable than silicon. but the future will tell ...
If you want to build a little higher than 1-2 plates then I would put together these 2pc stainless ends with 4pc bulltar against each other and then drill 4pc holes evenly so it will be 8pc threaded rods and TAG OUT HOW IT IS WHEN I DRILL 4PC EXTRA HOLES then build LOUD and have no bias on the glasses from the cooler, etc. ...
you can use regular galvanized threaded rods for they have no kontackt with the product, they are completely on the outside ....

The imagination is the limit .... but it will be tight between the plates so this is supposed to be both a cheap and effective solution to a bubble glass - glass column ...

Cheers 8-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Thu Jan 17, 2013 8:55 pm

Something that would be really effective and interesting would be stainless steel connections in 4 "and the next size glass - 6" glass that I've nagged about before, it is the active flat surface - wet tile surface that determines the distillation speed and then you can kind say 4 "have hormone treatment - tuned ...

What I have managed to read me, there are also glass tower - sight glasses in sizes from 2 "to 6" as standard, and a 6 "glass tower, mounted on a 4" column reductions would provide a substantial increase in power of the distillation rate .. .. Talk about hormone-treated 4 "facility ...

just a small idea, to get a faster distillation in a fully modular glass column ... as may be appropriate to both Sieve plates, several bubbelcaps and 1pc big bubbelcaps ... imagination is the limit, and here you see really how everything works down into losing detail and it will be 100% tightly between the plates and the column wall so all calculations of sieve plates 100% accurate ....
And cheap it is ... this modular glass column :idea:

Cheers 8-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:00 pm

minime wrote:Why don't you consider using Teflon for the plates Harley? It has an extremely low expansion rate and cut to the right size could serve as both plate and gasket between sections.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VIRGIN-TEFLON-S ... 51a6f5be84

I bought the two inch tower BTW. Just want to watch how reflux behaves as it enters the packing



I prefer copper for the unique ability to reduce them unpalatable sulphides, but for those who do not care about this so can teflon be a good option ..

Cheers 8-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby Harry » Thu Jan 17, 2013 9:57 pm

harley wrote:
minime wrote:Why don't you consider using Teflon for the plates Harley? It has an extremely low expansion rate and cut to the right size could serve as both plate and gasket between sections.
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VIRGIN-TEFLON-S ... 51a6f5be84

I bought the two inch tower BTW. Just want to watch how reflux behaves as it enters the packing



I prefer copper for the unique ability to reduce them unpalatable sulphides, but for those who do not care about this so can teflon be a good option ..

Cheers 8-)


The small amount of interaction gained from copper plates is not worth considering. Teflon plates would be much more suitable AND easier to fashion. Copper contact for sulphide removal can be easily done with a Lamella Catalyzer (canister full of copper) on top of the dephlegmator. See my post here.
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:10 pm

I've worked some with Teflon and then used it as plain bearings in various telescopic extension.

My experience of Teflon is that this is a very good "self-lubricating" product with extremely low glide ratio ...

But as sealing plate then I would personally choose copper and EPDM rubber gaskets.

Teflon is not self-healing if there would be a mark in the sealing surface and then the whole Teflon plate replaced .... 1pc EPDM rubber gasket is much cheaper .... Now I count this as a fully modular glass column and picking a little, there is a difference if you put it together once and then let it be then teflon be excellent, but expensive ...

Cheers
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Thu Jan 17, 2013 11:36 pm

Then there is another side to look at this too:
I personally am using 100% pure copper and pure stainless steel on which the sprite - the product can connect with, and all gaskets and I will have materials that can withstand spirits and are tested so they do not give a taint or add anything that is not good. .

Teflon I know nothing about? and if this can "let go" from something that is not good ...

Cheers 8-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:35 am

Threaded rods ...

I see several possible solutions in front of me ...


One solution is to produce round pipe which has a short time bar at one end type a bolt without head .. and a corresponding thread in the tube second end, and having a length corresponding to the judgment module + glass plate including gaskets ... then we can assemble them in theory to any length ...

or just a threaded tube that you can insert the short ends of the threaded rods, etc. ..

Another solution is to have a clean threaded rod of the same length as glass modules + plate and gaskets and then have about 4-5 cm long, 6 - square thread bolts that joined in every joint ....

There are certainly several good solutions, you just have to think of them as anything

But my personal belief is that 8pc threaded rods is necessary to relieve the glasses from any uneven loads if one replaces a dash distillation column with a glass column ..

Cheers 8-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Fri Jan 18, 2013 2:43 am

Hey Punkin
So you've started to like glass columns modular as the whole glass columns .... ;-)

Give the customer what the customer wants ... it has always been my proverbs and is the basis of a sales company :idea:

Sorry but it was "open goal" and I could not help it :oops:

Cheers 8-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby Stinger » Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:06 am

Fester wrote:The threaded rod is a bugger, though. Add or remove a glass module and you need to cut another bunch of thread-all? That aint my cup of tea and I'll need to do some piddling on that. Making a bunch of 'module rods' the same size as the height of the glass will add extra expense.

Hey Fester,
For convenience SD might stock just a few lengths (say for 2, 4, and 6 units). Threaded rod - stainless or other - for different combinations is easily sourced at any hardware store, though the cost would probably be greater than through SD.
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Fri Jan 18, 2013 3:15 am

minime wrote:
harley wrote:Teflon I know nothing about? and if this can "let go" from something that is not good ...

http://www.coleparmer.com/Chemical-Resistance
Chemical Compatibility
Material Selected: EPDM
Chemical Ethanol A-Excellent

Bookmark it Harley. You'll find it very useful ;-)

Virgin Teflon is somewhat self healing too



Thanks Minnime.

If teflon would be suitable as a seal, so I guess I would personally prefer copper plates and if so, teflon gaskets sealing ...But a still think that EPDM is best ;-)

Glass, copper, stainless steel, silicone and EPDM rubber is always salable, then mix in other newer products can be slow to start with, even if they are better, etc. ...

but like everything else, it's a price issue ... and what the market wants ...

Cheers 8-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Fri Jan 18, 2013 7:33 am

Some free thoughts and ideas of myself ... I have as you all notice a have little too much time "over" currently ... :idea:


There is much that you can do with distillation plates when you have a glass column with short glass between each plate.

For example, one can make the plate about 15-20mm thick and then be able to evacuate - to activate plate in the same manner as the OD of the MK 11 ... and it is possible to also build in CIP head in the same way ... also thermometer between each plate and perhaps more features.

This is a premium in a 4 "column for hobby use, but in a 6" or 8 "that even small
commercial distilleries use, then this would be optimally ...

Pressed copper plate is available in principle in all different shapes and you can churn out the distillation plate with 1pc giant bubbelcaps if you want in 6 "or 8" sizes .... this would be a cheap bubble plate and constructed in exactly the same way as the 'great players' the distillation plates ... (Fester and Law of Oms know what I'm talking about )

I actually see only advantages to having glasses in short sections when we're talking glass column and the plate and the seal is something that will work out by itself when it has begun to use this simple and cheap solution ...

The plate( sieve, bubbel) may cost a lot of money depending on what you choose to do with it, but the seal must be inexpensive and easily replaceable because it is a consumable item ... and all parts must go to buy loose so they can combine their own solutions to their own wants and needs
In other words, fully modular glass column

A glass colon is very awesome for customers (and myself) to watch! and you can also solve this in a cheap way, when I see a really big market in front of me ... :idea:


Cheers
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:07 pm

If I were to send these 10 +10 cm and a wall thickness glass thickness of approximately 6-8mm, I would have chosen to package them separately. 1pc in a small thin wooden box which is lined with 1cm "sleeping" type ... ie soft styroform, or something like that .. so they are completely still and embedded ...

This must be so safe transportation that can get this ... and small 4-6mm thin wooden boxes must be cheap to manufacture in China .. I think ..

I had initially put on a few% on the price so you have paid for a real wooden box for each separate glass and this minimized the risk of injury ...

entire column, I would send In separat parts and be extra careful to pack the glasses ...

So here should I have done, :idea:

Cheers
Last edited by harley on Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:39 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Fri Jan 18, 2013 9:33 pm

Now we are talking freights, etc., so I would suggest that Sd acquire a sales representative, just as Punkin is for his country ..
the one who lives and works in England because you - Sd get access to Eu,'s single market without a lot of problems with customs, tax, control, etc. ...
It is legal to the holder distillation in England to manufacture ethanol to his car and it is also legally sell distillation equipment for this ... i think, but check it :idea:
Eu's internal market is BIG ...

Just a suggestion on how I personally would solve this problem as it is to be outside the Eu and sell to the EU ....


And no, I live in Sweden so I can not be of assistance to fix this, unfortunately.
Cheers
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Sat Jan 19, 2013 3:44 am

I personally had solved the evacuation, emptying the plates together with the return ...

By having a slightly thicker tube type 14mm internally as a liquid seal caps, sitting on under plate in the air, and a thinner tube type about 13.5 mm exterior that has gone into the larger tube, and in this way also could regulate the height of liquid on the plate .. .0 mm, 10mm and 20mm for an exampel...
Two birds with one stone .. I like this ... and regulation of the thinner tubes can either do this by "thick plate" or through a hole in the glass as you are on ..

Fester take it easy.... :idea:

Now take it calmly and think through this carefully so everything is optimal from the beginning ..
This may be how big any time if you do it the right way from the start and did not hurry up then something must be changed later....


Modular fluid height in a modular column :grin: from 0mm to 20mm for an exampel :idea:
Look at the picture that I have sent to both you and the law of oms :idea:

this is the simplest solution and the one that takes a minimum plate surface in the claims .. and this has a huge impact on it's active, wet flat surface that determines the plate efficiency destilations speed and one should be careful of, active surface ...

I still think you should look at the solution to have a thicker copper plate and try to have everything in it including the regulation of the height of the liquid level on the plate and so on. in order to build on the plate down with a few centimeters in a ring type ... and both fit these solutions and getting them invisible from the front and from above ... and still have a flat plate on top where the liquid is boiling ...
just one idea among many ...

and those who want to have all these features with adjustable liquid height on all plates and also the opportunity to empty places magnify and this make them in-active pay for it, but everyone wants to take to have this so choice must be ... always fully modular also possibilities that the price .. you pay for what you get ... and want

This is just some free ideas that I have, and everything is all good intentions ....

Cheers 8-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby FullySilenced » Tue Jan 22, 2013 1:34 pm

Those may have been the elusive punkin balls
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Re: Sight towers

Postby JagCrusher » Tue Jan 22, 2013 4:43 pm

Fester wrote:Yes, we just need to find a way to minimize breakage.
Even when excessive packing material is used the postal people can be vicious.

More than a year ago, I had several pieces made that were 700mm long. Two were broken upon arrival to me and they were well packed inside a wooden crate.
That’s another reason I like the shorter, modular glass sections. At least some should survive the brutality.


An idea that sprang to mind as I read this thread... have you tried using PVC pipe as an an outer protective 'sleeve' for the sight glasses? Underground drainage pipe should be available in suitable diameters. Just a thought... ;-)
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Wed Jan 23, 2013 6:59 am

Fester!

it would be interesting if you have the ability to control power demand on both glass versus metal ... for the glass insulates it should be consumed less power .. only to be told the difference if there is some one in power requirements ..
Now, there may also be differences with copper plates against Teflon that you use and this may prove to both the power consumption as % to the product ...
More testing and testing is needed, so you really know all of the different variables and what they result in :idea:

Dont get too drank-too influenced by alcohol only :idea:

Cheers
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Re: Sight towers

Postby bt1 » Wed Jan 23, 2013 8:24 am

fester,

once you've nailed the styro packing reckon Aussie delivery anytime soon is likely?

cheers
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Re: Sight towers

Postby bt1 » Fri Jan 25, 2013 7:35 pm

Blokes,

very keen to get on with a glass col. Any chance we could get the dimensions of the sight glasses themselves so bloke can get plates done.
ID, OD height.

Understand they vary batch to batch ...what are we talking here +/- 1mm?

much appreciated

bt1
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Sat Jan 26, 2013 12:22 am

Fester
These sight tower are also available in 6 ", it would be interesting to see how a 6" would perform with 4 "reductions in both ends so you can use the same reflux and cooler that you have 4" glass column ....
And in 4 plate configuration, for tasted produkt...
But you get an active plate area is more than twice as large for a cheap price, much produkt speed for little money :idea:
Just an idea that might be interesting to test in practical ... the price is low on parts for these sight tower and a 6 "can be a good and economical solution for many ... private and small distillers ...

Cheers
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Sat Jan 26, 2013 2:16 am

Smaug wrote:
harley wrote:These sight tower are also available in 6 ", it would be interesting to see how a 6" would perform with 4 "reductions in both ends so you can use the same reflux and cooler that you have 4" glass column ....


I'm betting it would perform quite well Harley.



I think that this solution can be a real "killer" and I look forward to a proper field test of this configuration .... 8-)

it would be interesting to get a proper comparison between a 4 "4 plates and a 6" 4 plates both in production speed and power requirements and the remaining parts, reflux and product cooler from a 4 "column ... and obviously both columns in glass .. . the same conditions but just different sizes of column
This is something that I personally see as the biggest sales success if this "test" would fall out well ... :idea:

For the commercial market, I see the greatest use of 3-4 plates for the flavored products and 1pc distillation and 18-20 plates for neutral products and 1pc distillation.
For individuals- private peopel it's completely different conditions!

Something that I miss in Sd range is a copper catalyst that removes the bad sulphides in the product ...
We must see " together" if we can solve in a simple and inexpensive way, the need for a copper catalyst is great and necessary in stainless steel and glass columns if you want a good taste of the final product ...

Cheers
Last edited by harley on Sat Jan 26, 2013 3:15 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Sight towers

Postby Jung4g » Sat Jan 26, 2013 4:28 am

minime wrote:More symphony in glass
Image


This would be awesome as part of a tour in a commercial distillery to show the process, and equally awesome in a proper man-cave.

Fester, does it feel stable and strong enough to hold up the condenser/parrort assembly even off the 4 threaded rods? Or is that supported in some way I'm not noticing?
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Sun Jan 27, 2013 12:00 am

Fester
I think that EPDM is more appropriate as seals between the glass and the copper plate than silicone gaskets.
Epdm withstand higher pressure load than silicon, only a reflection.

Cheers
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Re: Sight towers

Postby harley » Sun Jan 27, 2013 7:25 am

I "believe" that EPDM is a more appropriate gasket material between the copper plate and the glass is based on the silicone is too soft to withstand the high pressure and long lasting as it can be when tightening threaded rods that hold the whole package ...

This is not based on what is theoretically best ore what peopel want, but practically the best ...
Silicone Gaskets are simply too soft ....

the easiest is to try both options for a time and then draw a conclusion ...

If you have a chance to make it work with silicone gaskets, then it would probably the gasket between 2pc elevations in other words, immersed as silicone gasket can not get somewhere, then it can work with silicone gaskets .. and elevations also has a control function for the the glasses ...

Take a look on Harry draving-foto in this link, he have what a think is needed for a silicon gasket to stay in place viewtopic.php?f=15&t=1060&start=40



Maybe Teflon and epdm may be a suitable solution, but unfortunately it becomes securely for expensive ...

I personally would look into whether it would be possible to allow the production of a epdm gasket that it "lurched" around the copper plate and in this way got a seal on both sides of the copper plate and the gasket should always be 100% in position, but that's my personal solution ....

look in this link below :text-coolphotos:

http://www.newmangasket.com/orificeplategaskts.htm

Cheers
Last edited by harley on Sun Jan 27, 2013 7:27 am, edited 1 time in total.
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