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What went wrong with first strip run ?

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What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Mon May 25, 2015 5:28 pm

G'day all, tossed my first mash 35L with my new Pot Head in the Keg,
Seperated the first 350 mls of foreshots & Head.
Then started to collect my mix for a second stilling run, !2 hrs later 2 litres output.
Tasted nice but a very slow drip rate.
The temp at the Thermometer tube rose fast after the boil started when the temp got to the mid to high 80's.
I decided to wind it back a bit with my Triac driven potentiometer controller that I'd made.
Tried to keep the vapour temp in top of the pot head at 78 Deg C but had a hard time doing that so settled at around 84 Deg C.
If I hadn't used the voltage controller it would go up over 90 Deg C.
I'm only using a 1800 Watt heater element.
Geez in the time it took for my first 2 litres I could have done 3 Reflux runs.
At this rate I'll have to do 18 mashes & stripping runs to get enough for my second distill run.
Should I just forget about the temp for the strip run & disregard what temp it gets too ?
That or go back to the tried & true Reflux stilling & forget about Potting.
Very disappointed Tassie Tiger
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Otago Elvis » Mon May 25, 2015 6:10 pm

The aim of a strip run is to extract as much alcohol from the wash as you can.

You need not worry about cuts and temperatures.

Strip the wash as hard as your still will allow. Take all the alcohol down to 20% and turn off the still. Your collect is your low wines.

With a 1800watt element in a 50 litre keg you should not need temp control to acheive this.

Stick with it, it gets easier :lol:

Stripping will give you a much cleaner/tastier neutral.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby JayD » Mon May 25, 2015 7:25 pm

As mentioned previously, a stripping wash is just that to strip the alcohol from your wash as fast as you can...so you want to bring your boiler to the boil and set your cooling water flat out and as long as you are still collapsing the vapour back to a liquid with out puking...puking is when the contents of your boiler flood into the still, instead of lighter alcohols, I would still remove your fores, then collect the rest down to 20%, 20% is the point it is no longer a gain to collect as it cost you more...less bang for your buck,
Once you have collected enough low wines to fill your boiler with a 40% charge, then you want to be fussy and chase the abv you want....do proper cuts...fores/heads /hearts and tails it will be become second nature once you have done it a couple of times. Your run should only take about three and a half hours. :handgestures-thumbupright:
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Maheel » Mon May 25, 2015 9:07 pm

u cannot really control the temp in a pot still

as product comes out temp must rise as there is less alc in the water (lower ALC/H20 ratio) and boiling temp rises.

depending on your "Mash gravity" i would expect a lot more volume on a pot strip run of 2hrs
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby JayD » Mon May 25, 2015 9:34 pm

imo...and I respect your opinion Maheel, you can control your boil by your heat input...more heat = harder boil, less heat=slower boil, so if you can control the roll of the boil you are controlling the heat of your boiler. This is why you adjust the heat as needed during your run. :handgestures-thumbupright: We tweek our heat as needed during the run. A view port on your boiler is a good tool for learning the rolling boil.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Maheel » Mon May 25, 2015 10:10 pm

yep you sure can adjust the power input but it will still be boiling at X temp
it will control the "boil" but not the boiling temps

X % alc to H20 ratio will = boil temp

thus the temp should rise accordingly as less alc
by trying to adjust vapor temps downwards in pot still runs you might actually stop boiling depending on your ratio's

best to just do a few runs and try diff things and see what the output is :)
only TT will find his happy place (or happy spirits) with his still
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby JayD » Mon May 25, 2015 10:35 pm

Maheel wrote:yep you sure can adjust the power input but it will still be boiling at X temp
it will control the "boil" but not the boiling temps

X % alc to H20 ratio will = boil temp

thus the temp should rise accordingly as less alc
by trying to adjust vapor temps downwards in pot still runs you might actually stop boiling depending on your ratio's

best to just do a few runs and try diff things and see what the output is :)
only TT will find his happy place (or happy spirits) with his still



in the beginning some times less information is more information for a beginner...you can not beat hands on experience or experience hands down. My pot stills work a treat running them the way I mentioned above...a controlled rolling boil is the best way to run a still hands down, it works on pot stills, bubblers and all the JayDboka's I've built over years. Have you ever studied a glass kettle starting to boil, then watch it boil...observation is a great learning tool...then manipulating known parameters help to optimise settings,which intern helps the still run to it's potential. Call me TT if you need help.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Yummyrum » Tue May 26, 2015 12:34 am

Tassie.
You do what I do strip in a pot still and then reflux that in your reflux still.
Like the othe dudes said ......strip fast.Full power....get it over and done with .Should not take more than an hour or so per strip
.thats whole Idea of it .
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Tue May 26, 2015 2:57 pm

Thanks for the help & advice guys, I can see where I went wrong now.
I was too worried about the temp on the stripping run rather than just run it hot and watch out for any escaping vapour.
I'll run it again tonight as I havn't emptied the Keg yet, Too late & still hot Sunday night and forgot to take my trolley home last night to move 60 kg.
Special thanks to JayD for your concerns & advice/help.
When I get it all sorted I'll post a step by step account with recipe, photos etc & call it " A Learners Guide To Learning From My First Mistakes".
The one good thing so far is, at least I now have a 2nd Generation "Tassie Tiger Piss" on it's way. Or should I tame it down & call it "Tassie Tiger Juice" ?
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby still_stirrin » Wed May 27, 2015 12:45 am

Tassie Tiger wrote:...I was too worried about the temp on the stripping run rather than just run it hot and watch out for any escaping vapour....

Yup, think of it like this....

The vapo(u)r will come off at the saturation temperature of the mixture. Initially, the mixture includes "lighter" alcohols and fores, in addition to the ethyl alcohol and water, AND the tails (fusels/oils). This mixture will boil at a saturation temperature of the combined components. The vapor temperature (if measured) will reflect the lighter components first.

But the remaining liquid in the boiler is changing its composition as the lighter constituents are being liberated. With that, the temperature of the vapor will change (because the saturation temperature of the mix is changing). Remember, the saturation temperature of a liquid is the temperature at which it changes phases from liquid to vapor. And as the composition of the liquid changes, so will its saturation temperature...from the lighter components such as methanol and acetones to ethyl alcohol (what we want) to water.

So, in a pot still the temperature is determined by the phase change temperature of the remaining liquid in the boiler. Running the strip at the "rate" that your product condenser can change back to liquid (another change of phase) is controlled by the heat input (kW/s) in the boiler and should be matched by the heat removed in the condenser...heat in equals heat removed plus convective losses around the equipment.

You can control heat rate, not boil temperature. Adjusting the heat affects how fast the wash is converted to vapor, not the temperature at which it does. That is determined by the components that make up the wash, as noted.

Not trying to confuse you but the function of a reflux column is different matter and subject for another discussion. But as many have stated, the pot still cannot be "temperature regulated"....monitored, maybe. But don't try to run it based on a temperature measurement. Let her rip for the strip!
ss
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Wed May 27, 2015 9:21 am

Thanks for those words of wisdom SS. I think I follow what you mean, Just don't expect me to remember it all yet.
I did my 3rd attempt last night with the same wash.
Got to 60 Deg C so turned the water on flat out.
Measured almost 300 ml as foreshots then collected away.
Temp got up to 89 Deg C and it was giving a constant stream of around 20 % ABV. This could be due to the fact that this is the 3rd run with the that wash.
The Temp kept climbing up slowly & by the time it got to 92.2 Deg C I had collected a bit over 3 1/2 litres from this run & was getting just under 10% ABV.
This gave a total from this Batch of just under 6 litres.
I still had it stored in two seperate Demijohns so I'll blend them together tonight in a 8 litre pickling jar I have & then get a final ABV reading before I add water for the 2nd still run.
I do have 6 litres of Heads & Tails from previous Reflux runs & I'm not sure whether to add this to the 2nd run or maybe that may dilute the flavour that I'm chasing here.
Maybe some one would have some advise on that one.
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Zymurgy Bob » Thu May 28, 2015 12:58 am

Tassie, you say that a head temperature of ~89C gives you an output of ~20%ABV, and those numbers just don't work out, but I'm not sure what caused them. From the digram below, if you follow the 89C line to the right, you should have a wash ABV of ~19% and a distillate ABV of 66%.
Image
I suppose that if you are running very slowly with a huge amount of incidental reflux in a potstill riser, that might give your numbers, but I kinda doubt it. I'd check your thermometer (I've had one that got surprisingly cooled by conduction from the nearby condenser, but that was only a copleof degrees).
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Thu May 28, 2015 5:27 pm

Thanks for your advise Zymurgy Bob.
I came across that chart when I was researching what went wrong.
Let me start from the beginning of this Drama story.
I was Keen as Mustard to start my very first pot still run on Saturday so syphoned around 35 litres off the top of my mash into my 50 litre Keg.
Turned it on & had a beer or two to celebrate the first Pot Still run while I waited for the 2 hr preheat to start the flow.
It was about Half way through when I realized that I hadn't taken PH, SG or Alcometer readings & I thought too late now it should be all right.
I had just collected my 300 mls of fore shots when I had a water supply malfunction, didn't have spare parts to repair it & had too many beers to drive to the hardware store. So turned it off & left it at that.
Sunday morning I was nearly the first customer through the door at Mitre 10 got the parts I needed to redesign & repair the the problem.
So about 10 am turned the Keg on for attempt number 2.
A bit after midday I realized the temp was running away so I tried to control it with my voltage control unit I had made during the week.
I was having problems trying to keep it at the magic figure of 78 Deg C but I could control it at 84 Deg C so settled for that & just hoped it wasn't too hot.
Bear in mind this was my first stripping run & thought the aim was 78 C, I didn't know that for a stripping run there virtually are no Temp rules.
The one drip every 2 seconds did seem a bit slow compared to a Reflux run but thought it's what it is.
I was getting 70% ABV & thought that's higher than what I expected from a Pot Still.
So by the time I turned it off at 10 pm (12 hours later) & I only had 2 litres of spirit I was not a happy chappy.
On Monday I posted the What went wrong query on this site & after I had several replies with advice & a conversation with JayD I then knew where I had gone wrong.
So Tuesday night I started the 3rd attempt with the same wash & it settled out at 89 Deg C with a constant flow but only 20% ABV.
I thought that it may have been because this was the 3rd attempt with the same wash & just let it run.
After about 2 hrs of flow it had climbed up to 92.2 C & the alc showed 10% ABV & I had just over 3.5 litres.
Turned it off & thought I had nearly 6 litres total that will have to do.
Not sure what to make of those Readings Z Bob but I would put it in the same class as my Lap Top "never does as it should & I don't know why"
Thanks very much for your help Z Bob.
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Fri May 29, 2015 7:40 am

Did a blend of the whole batch & ended up with 25% ABV & 5.8 litres total.
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Zymurgy Bob » Fri May 29, 2015 5:58 pm

Well, I have to apologize if the link below sounds a bit snarky, and I don't mean it that way, but you need to know that attempting to control the temperature of a boiling wash in a potstill goes against (literally) the laws of nature. If you try for a lower temperature than the boiling point of your particular mixture, it just doesn't boil, and distillation can take days.
http://www.kelleybarts.com/PhotoXfer/ReadMeFirst/MagicBoilingMyth.html
This is something I put together for a beginners information section in another forum.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby JayD » Fri May 29, 2015 7:31 pm

Here is another link that may help...boiling :handgestures-thumbupright:
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby kimbodious » Fri May 29, 2015 9:02 pm

Let me get this straight, the lower the ABV, the higher the boiling point and if that is drastically over 78.37C then the higher the level of impurities in the product and the more like tails the product will be?
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Zymurgy Bob » Sat May 30, 2015 12:39 am

kimbodious wrote:Let me get this straight, the lower the ABV, the higher the boiling point

Exactly. For a simple ethanol-water mixture, which is a pretty good first approximation, as the ABV approaches 0%, the boiling point approaches 100C.
kimbodious wrote:and if that is drastically over 78.37C then the higher the level of impurities in the product and the more like tails the product will be?

At its simplest, and if you consider water to be an impurity, yes. For many of us "impurities" means the difference between plain vodka and the fine spirits of the world, the single malts, brandies (including eaux de vie), rums, and bourbons, but those wonderful impurities are in such small quantities that they don't affect boiling points much. And yes, if there is anything other than water and ethanol in your wash, there will always be some tails.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby kimbodious » Sat May 30, 2015 8:49 am

Thanks ZBob,
That would explain my last calamity with a TPW wash in my CM Reflux still. I put around 23 litres of wash in a 50 litre keg boiler and topped it up with another 20 litres if water which would have dropped the average ABV to 8% which by your chart makes the boiling point 94 degrees Celsius. Little wonder I was struggling to equalise the column.

Yes indeed, not all impurities are bad
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Mon Jun 01, 2015 5:27 pm

Thank You ZBob, I have printed out a copy of that link about the Myths of Boiling & it all makes sense now. I will study further tonight.
I've been reading up on what every one else say's about how they do it & what Temps they use rather than realizing that you & I can have the same still & same wash recipe & still end up with a different taste of product at the end.
As they say, "practice makes perfect " I just need a lot of practice.
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Zymurgy Bob » Tue Jun 02, 2015 2:56 am

Guys, I'm really happy it helped. I'm sorry if it comes across as a bit snarky, but I've answered those questions so many times, often during bitter arguments, that I'm inclined to be a bit "emphatic" on the subject.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Mon Jun 29, 2015 1:17 pm

Thanks to all who have helped solve my Drama.
It seems it was a problem of my own creation, I was not just letting the strip run, run it's course.
But due to the advice given I now know not to panic about Temps when stripping.
Have been out of town for 3 weeks repairing a Power Station Generator, 11hr days, 17 days straight.
No action by me in the Stilling Shed but I now have 3X 60 litre batches ready to go.
One's a Second Generation Tassie Tiger Juice (whiskey), One's a Pear & Apple Schnapps that's nearly ready to go & the last one started life as a Sugar & water Reflux wash that may end up being a Rum depending on which Still Head I use. Not real keen on Rum so It most likely will be a Reflex Wash that I can do berry infusions ( pantie droppers ).
Cheers to all TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby JayD » Mon Jun 29, 2015 2:49 pm

Welcome back... :obscene-drinkingcheers:
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:55 am

Hi to all reading this, Did a second Generation run with my Wheat & Rye whisky at the weekend.
No where near the dramas I had with my first stripping run of this mixture, I just let it run it's course.
Settled in nice at 88 Deg C & I got a nice constant stream on this strip run but worst thing was I forgot to take my alco-meter with me.
I now have about 7 1/2 litres of stripped whisky of unknown ABV %. All cool I'll go around to my Stilling venue today & measure it.
In total I now have about 15 litres from the first two strip runs I have done with this batch.
I'm guessing one or two more strip runs from the same batch & I'll have enough to then dilute it with water to less than 40 % ABV & do my second still run or Spirit run if I remember my terms correctly.
I'm beginning to think that maybe building a perforated plate unit will be quicker than dilly dallying around with the way I'm doing it now but I'm sure good things come to those who wait.
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Wed Jul 08, 2015 9:51 am

Hi all, I ended up with 7 1/2 litres of stripped whiskey at 30 % ABV,
Didn't test it as it ran so may have run this one a bit long into the tails & it's watered it down a bit lower than I was hoping for.
A few more strip runs & I'll have enough for a Spirit run.
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby bigfoot » Wed Jul 08, 2015 3:06 pm

All good - Just means less water to reach 40%.
I understand the preferred way is a strip run and then a spirit run - and I am in the middle of doing that myself now, but 1st run hearts can be pretty reasonable if care is taken.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Mon Jul 13, 2015 5:47 pm

Yep I try the spoon taste test as I go along & the Heart middle section is quite nice but am hoping to get enough to do a spirit run of the Tassie Tiger Piss/whiskey.
The Pear & Apple Schnapps I did a stripping run of at the w'end had a nice Heart flavour but not much of it.
I was tempted to separate it but have decided to be patient with all the multi generation mixes I have going in 60 litre barrels at the moment & save them up for a 2nd run of each flavour.
Otherwise it will take for ever to get enough to do a Spirit run, a litre off each run equates to 1 extra stripping run I have to do to get enough.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Thu Aug 06, 2015 5:32 pm

G'day to all reading this thread,
Well I think all the effort is paying off now, Did another strip run last weekend & I ended up pleased with the result.
I make up a 60 litre batch, syphon 37 litres into the Keg then add my mix to the 23 litres left in the barrel.
The last run I got 7.5 litres at 37 % ABV, best run yet before the tails dropped off to 20% ABV & I turned it off.
The Hearts was very nice !
Now have about 20 litres ready for the spirit run but I'm thinking at least one more run before I have enough to do the spirit run.
6litres of 20% ABV + 7litres of 30% ABV + 7.5litres of 37% ABV so far.
Once I can get 37 litres of around 30% ABV I'll be as happy as a pig in the proverbial.
If it or should I say when it turns out to be a great tasting drink I'll post it in the experimental section as Tassie Tiger Juice Wiskey.
I'm expecting it to take about another month before I start it on the Oak aging stage.
I sure hope it tastes as good as the stripping run Heart tastes.
I think in future I'll do either several 60litre ferment barrels at a time or do it in my 100litre barrel or maybe use my 2 big 240litre, I think they are, new wheelie bins that I just scored for free.
That way it won't take 4 to 5 months like it does now just using one 60litre ferment barrel at a time.
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Mon Aug 10, 2015 11:44 am

G'day to all reading this thread,
Just noticed there have been over a thousand log on to this thread so far!
I'm thinking it could be curious people to see how it works out or maybe the name catches peoples attention.
Most likely due to all the good Help & informative advice I have received along the way on a subject that most first timers can relate to.
Did an Apple, Blackcurrant & Pear Schnapps stripping run at the weekend 8 litres at 43% ABV was a good result I thought.
At the same time I decided to stir up & divide the left overs in the Tassie Tiger Juice Whiskey ferment barrel into 2x 60 litre barrels to speed up the time taken to get to the Spirit Run stage.
I'm guessing by the time these are ready for a strip run in a months time I'll have enough for that Spirit run.
If I have too much I can save it for the next Spirit Run, not like it's going to go off, it will keep for ever.
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby bigfoot » Wed Aug 12, 2015 3:35 am

Hey TT - just wondering how you are going to do your spirit run ?
Curious about how one might run a pot still "slow" for a spirit run - or is it pot still for strips and reflux for spirit? If the latter, would the reflux remove flavour?
Thanks bf.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Wed Aug 12, 2015 9:46 am

G'day Bigfoot, I always use different recipes when I use the Reflux Head or Pot Head on my Keg.
TPW wash for Reflux, Neutral spirit output.
Fruit Juice for Schnapps & I suppose you could call my cooked wheat bix, ryvita & honey Tassie Tiger Piss a Whisky.
The slow spirit run I use a 1800watt element & I plan to try out a Triac based Electric motor speed controller unit I made to chop the input sine wave so I'm using variable power by only using part of the sine wave.
In a nut shell I'm varying the voltage & the current or Amps through a Potentiometer that gives me variable Power input to the Element.
I think our US viewers call them Phase Controllers. But their voltages are different to ours in Aus.
That was how this thread first started, I was trying to control the vapour temp on the Stripping Run instead of just letting it run it's course.
I have also now fitted a fine tune Potentiometer to the unit & will trial it out on my virgin Spirit Run in a months time.
If the 240 volt single phase unit works OK I will let every one know.
And yes a Reflux Spirit Run will strip the output to a Neutral Spirit, no flavour.
I hope this answers your Question BF & hasn't confused the readers too much.
CHEERS TT
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby liquidtherapy » Wed Aug 12, 2015 11:23 am

You can pick these scr power controllers up all over flee bay for around 10.00 us.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Wed Aug 12, 2015 1:52 pm

Thanks Liquid, It probably cost me more than twice that to pick up the Triac, Diac, few Resistors a potentiometer & heat sink from Jaycar.
Then there was a plastic box, a few cable glands, male & female plugs from my store room plus time to make it.
Not a cost effective way to go about it I'm seeing now.
Onto E-bay shopping next it seems.
Are those terminals 240 Volt single phase in & output or is that 3 phase & Earth output terminals ?
Thanks for the Tip Liquid,
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby liquidtherapy » Wed Aug 12, 2015 3:17 pm

It's 240 single phase. Pretty simple to wire up. I actually ran accosted a couple ready made for a reasonable price. Pretty much plug and play.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Wed Aug 12, 2015 5:00 pm

I just had a thought Liquid, by using an SCR drive your actually converting AC to DC.
That's what a Silicon Controlled Rectifier does, it's a gated Diode with the Potentiometer to vary or control the DC conversion.
That was the reason I went for a Triac as it chops a bit off the Positive & the Negative part of the sine wave so you still an AC output to your Element.
For a Heating Element though they will still do the same job.
Another piece of useless information I learnt during two years of Industrial Electronics.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Wed Sep 23, 2015 4:38 pm

I got to the spirit run stage a few weeks ago.
37 litres at 28% ABV
I got a total of 13.5 litres by the time it got to 20% ABV.
I used wine bottles for collection marked at the 500 ml level.
After 400 ml of foreshots, bottles 1 to 5 were a bit sharp to taste.
Bottles 6 to 9, I would say the taste improved.
10 to 15 I think it was, the taste was magic, Honey all the way.
16, 17 the taste had changed but still very smooth.
By the time bottle 18 had reached the 500 ml level I could taste that watery wet cardboard flavour of the Tails.
The surprising thing was that bottle 19 was still around 50% ABV.
I don't have my note book with me now but I thought I may as well put an ending to this story.
I have typed up an experimental recipe on my computer that may be the longest ever written on this site but I may ask JayD to proof read it for me before I post it.
CHEERS TT Hope you all enjoyed the drama story of my first stripping run
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby bigfoot » Wed Sep 23, 2015 9:57 pm

I appreciate the write up.
I too am at the "first strip run" phase (UJSM) - it certainly takes some time, especially when working 50+ hours a week.
So from my reading - you ended up with 4 litres?

I guess I am wondering - is the effort "that" much better than other methods? ie a pot single vs a doue vs a reclux vs a mixture. It takes me months to get 30 odd litres stripped - and I am wondering if a more careful first pass placed on oak, for the same time it takes to strip 30+ litres and then oak is that much better?..I mean, all merits says it should but is my palette developed enough to notice? I hope it is - and if b"it is, ill continue stripping and doing spirits.

What would you say TT - def worth it??
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Sun Oct 25, 2015 10:46 am

After a month on carbon & exposure to air & about 2 or 3 shakes a week I decided to put Bottles 3 to 18 on oak chips.
Roasted about 30grams of chips on the weber wrapped in foil, about half of it turned dark & started to smoke so tossed that in.
Then added about 40 to 50 grams of un-toasted chips to the Glass Jar, gave it a stir & left open overnight.
ABV 55%.
Next morning about the colour of a very weak tea.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Wed Nov 11, 2015 8:17 am

Hi to all, I've had a lucky break with cooking the cereals.
I did a Brix reading & got a reading of 15.1 Brix.
What I did different this time around was the addition of Stills Spirits Alpha Amylase Enzyme to each batch of cereals as I cooked them.
Wow They tasted sweet after 5-6 hrs of cooking.
I didn't take individual readings but took the reading after adding them all together.
A reading of 15.1 is about the same as 3kg of sugar per 4 to 4.5 litres.
I also performed the Iodine test on a teaspoon of must & got a positive reading. No colour change after a drop of Iodine landed.
I will be doing this again in future & even wishing I had done the same with the Nutri-Grain wash I had done the week before, always next time though.
I also used 3kg of Wheat bix & 3kg of Ryvita per 100 litres.
I would suggest trying this Enzyme out on any Grain mix you try in future.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Fri Nov 20, 2015 9:41 am

Hi to all, I've had the batch above fermenting for a week now & last night found 3 kg of Leather Wood Honey in a shopping bag in the cupboard under my cooking bench.
I think the whole street heard me swearing at myself for forgetting to put it in.
The ferment tub is full so what I plan to do tonight is drain a few litres off the top & heat it enough to dissolve the honey then pour it back in when cool.
Hope it's not too late but judging by the bubble rate I'm guessing it still has a week to go.
Funny I had a strange feeling I'd forgotten some thing but was going out to a Black-Tie fund raiser ball that night & was pushed for time & distracted thoughts.
I now see why JayD & Filthy Phil do most things in pairs so if one forgets to do some thing the other will notice & raise the subject.
Pretty sure I wont make that mistake again though.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Sat Nov 28, 2015 5:57 pm

Syphoned off a few litres & heated it up then dissolved the Leatherwood Honey in it then added it back into the ferment barrel a little at a time.
Even though I was only adding a little at a time & stiring it in as I went I still ended up with a bit of foam over so I had a little bit of sticky mess to clean up after.
I knew what to expect as I've had it happen before when wine making but it had worked well up until the last little bit went in then it just seemed to foam up then.
In all the confusion of moving the Barrel & cleaning up the mess I'd made I didn't end up taking an SG reading.
I'm guessing it would be a little higher than the 1066 I had prior to adding the honey.
Still bubbling away with about 5 seconds between big purges of bubbles through the airlock.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby bigfoot » Sun Nov 29, 2015 10:28 pm

Just a Q - I tried something similar with coffee beans, camevoutvokay but then someone pointed out - hey, why don't you just add your wanted flavour(in this case honey) to the wash just before destilling it?
If you added a kg of honey into the process at still stage - wouldn't that result in more flavour carry over?
Just throwing darts here...:-)
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Mon Nov 30, 2015 7:21 am

Hi BF, I did consider doing that but didn't want to change my recipe routine too much.
Have been thinking about adding a half kilo at the distilling stage.
Another experiment to try out.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Wed Dec 16, 2015 10:52 am

Hi all, Well the time has come to do a Stripping Run of the enzyme treated batch.
Loaded up the Keg last night so as soon as I get home from work tonight I'll be starting the Gas burner to get underway.
This will be the real first taste test of difference between the enzyme treated & the previous method.
By the way the Oak chip soaking batch I started in Oct is starting to improve too.
A mate & I tried a bit the other night & he asked " is that the same as we tried about a month ago ? "
He's not a drinker at all but being a Chemist he'll give a good opinion of flavours he tastes.
He wants a bottle when I decide it's ready, so that's a good sign I think.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Thu Dec 17, 2015 8:17 am

Hi all, The stripping run for the Enzyme treated batch went well & I ended up with about 13 litres.
Haven't checked the % ABV yet as it's in two 8 litre Glass Jars and I haven't blended them or measured the total amount yet.
The flavours were quite nice & strong so I'm keen to see what the spirit run produces.
The beer was 12.2 % ABV but I'm expecting the final stripped product or low wines to be low as I ran it a bit below 20%ABV when collecting.
Will let the remainder in the ferment barrel sit for a few more days as it looked a bit cloudy & started to bubble again after I'd re-sealed the drum.
The next batch will be in a 220 litre Barrel so I should get a better yield from it.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby bigfoot » Thu Dec 17, 2015 9:57 pm

Having read various methods and taking some direction from TT and Bob Z, I have my final corn wash strip run to complete over weekend. This will give me 20 litres of 45-50% but instead of watering this down to run the spirit run, I have (or will) keep 20 litres of low alc wash(7%) to add into final strip run...hoping for additional flavour to carry over.
I just wonder how far can you go with the grain - ie could I press the mash for extra flavour??
Bf.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Zymurgy Bob » Fri Dec 18, 2015 5:08 am

BF, I hope you're happy with the flavor doing the last run with some wash in there; it's worked best for me that way. As far as pressing the wet grain for more liquid, that can work up to a point, depending on what grains and enzymes you're used, what the filter material is, and how hard you squeeze. Squeezing some grains hard can turn a porous fabric into an impermeable membrane.

Let us know what you did and how it worked out.
Zymurgy Bob, a simple potstiller http://www.kelleybarts.com/zymurgy-bob-books/making-fine-spirits/

You can make whisky in a reflux still, you can make vodka in a potstill,
and you can eat chicken noodle soup with a crescent wrench. But..
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Fri Dec 18, 2015 7:24 am

Hi BF & ZB, I have a few litres put aside for that purpose.
Only 6 litres but I'm now thinking of saving a bit more.
Will be good to hear how it goes for you BF.
I'm cooking up a corn flakes wash this weekend & thinking about adding some Alpha Amylase Enzyme during the cooking stage.
Not sure if it will work as well for corn as it did for Wheat bix & Ryvita but will see what happens.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby Tassie Tiger » Sun Dec 20, 2015 6:35 am

Hi all, did my second stripping run yesterday from the enzyme batch & got 12 litres @ 50 % ABV.
It's now just a matter of making time to blend the two batches for a spirit run.
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Re: What went wrong with first strip run ?

Postby bigfoot » Thu Dec 24, 2015 8:18 am

Tassie Tiger wrote:Hi BF & ZB, I have a few litres put aside for that purpose.
Only 6 litres but I'm now thinking of saving a bit more.
Will be good to hear how it goes for you BF.

CHEERS TT


I finally found a few hours to strip my final UJSM wash last night. I now have 35 odd litres of low wines.
I also lightly pressed the remaining corn and added that outcome into some left over wash and am racking that now ready.
So 55 litres of spirit run ready to fire, will be interesting to see the difference in flavour from pressing the kernels - if at all.
Just need to find the 6 odd hours to do a slllloooowww spirit run at 1000w.Reckon these holidays wil provide:-), The outcome will be barrelled in French oak for at least 3 months...flowing on advice from here, I won't try and drink any bourbon Esque style drinks under that age.
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